Sensah Empire

[familyguy]

Well, so far, so good...best AliExpress postage service ever. April 1 order, April 13 arrival.

So I got some slack at lunch time and unboxed this gear. I have started an image thread here:
https://imgur.com/a/0BICpkd

First comment is 'I like the separate crank spider idea'. Makes them MUCH easier to post, if nothing else!

Will chuck the spider and rings on later and get some parts photos tomorrow in the sunlight if I get some time.

Jim

[AUbicycles]

Very interesting... and better availability than other brands!

[familyguy]

[familyguy]

So claimed weights are pretty much bang on...

Cranks, BB, RD, FD, brakes, shifters:


As above with chain and cassette added:


Comparative chart of actual weighed groupsets (not manuf. claimed weights):

[MichaelB]

What is the quality/finish line ?

[familyguy]

Some initial comments after playing with it off-bike with the caveat that some of this will change once the parts are on and angry.

Shifters:
Weighty enough to not feel carbon/plastic. Finish seems smooth and consistent, no burrs or mis-moulded edges. Lever throw is large, but I have big hands so this may be an issue for some. Very much like SRAM double tap, but more than one upshifts feels like it is all but impossible due to the length of the throw in the system. Lever bodies feel a good size. Unsure how much metal v plastic is in the mechanism. Brake return spring seems a bit flimsy.

Brakes:
These feel like they might be a bit flexible. Springs seems a little more relaxed than 4700/5700. Build quality seems ok, but using them will be much more of a reliable test. Finish not as good as the Tiagra stuff I just sold, feels like the edges are a little lost. Pics after the weekend will show this a bit more I think.

RD:
Very SRAM in looks and feel. Actually seems to be a really nicely made unit. Feels nice but a little stiff in the spring action when pushed by hand. Might ease up as it works for the first time. Haven't had a detailed look at the joints/pins/springs.

FD:
As for RD. Having springs on the limit adjuster screws is odd, that sort of stuff is usually reserved for BSO gear.

Cranks:
The crank finish and quality actually surprised me. The forging seems good. The spider and rings bolted on without any movement. Very Rotor-esque. Haven't threaded a pedal on yet, and am yet to figure out just how the spindle/LH crank junction operates (seems bolted, not welded?) to see what adjustment can be made for different sized shells, but I'm not looking at them thinking "these are going to bend when I ride them".

BB:
This is a bit of an unknown quantity as yet but fits neatly on the spindle and has spacers for 68/73mm and a crank spacer included.

Jim

[familyguy]

A whole heap of photos up on the Imgur gallery, showing more detail of quality and finish for those interested:
https://imgur.com/a/0BICpkd

Jim

[dcolum23]

I must know more!

I am currently riding a much older Shimano 105 groupset and I'm tempted to "upgrade" to the Sensah Empire ... but like everyone, I'm hesitant. Will it actually be an upgrade? If so, how?

Can't wait to hear more about this @familyguy

[familyguy]

I must know more!

I am currently riding a much older Shimano 105 groupset and I'm tempted to "upgrade" to the Sensah Empire ... but like everyone, I'm hesitant. Will it actually be an upgrade? If so, how?

Can't wait to hear more about this @familyguy

Might not be a super-quick fit, gotta move in a couple of months so may not build the bike intended until after that.

But, that said, if I was riding 5600 105 (last one with the side-output gear cables I think), it would tempt me. Not so much if I was riding 5700 105 or current Tiagra. But for the price, seems sharp as an upgrade. The unknown is longevity and spares availability.

[blizzard]

I must know more!

I am currently riding a much older Shimano 105 groupset and I'm tempted to "upgrade" to the Sensah Empire ... but like everyone, I'm hesitant. Will it actually be an upgrade? If so, how?

Can't wait to hear more about this @familyguy

If you haven't already, you should check out Trace Velo's videos on YouTube about Sensah Empire.

[dcolum23]

I must know more!

I am currently riding a much older Shimano 105 groupset and I'm tempted to "upgrade" to the Sensah Empire ... but like everyone, I'm hesitant. Will it actually be an upgrade? If so, how?

Can't wait to hear more about this @familyguy

If you haven't already, you should check out Trace Velo's videos on YouTube about Sensah Empire.

Yeah, I've watched and read absolutely everything possibly consumable about the Sensah groupsets, which is why I'm not going to the people who have actually bought them ... I would love to know more. It seems as though it might just be best to be one of those ginea pigs for the community

[baabaa]

"Guinea" and not "ginea" and be it both pig or fowl just do it, why wait, try and buy, bet unless you race, it will be fine.
I have been weaning off shim stuff for a while now as consider they now just designed for looks and they have been testing stuff in terms of quality on the market since the 5600/6600 era.
Once you get microshift parts or to a lesser degree sunrace in your hands you will see it is simple, well made and just works - well.

The price from sensah is just bike parts without a huge marketing cost added on, like most things from Main Land China the quantity, end product finish quality and maybe the design will improve rapidly once they understand that they could export in volume.
My call is they wont bother and just focus on the domestic market and near by countries such as Laos, India, VietNam and Thai markets which are having huge growth in faster but maybe not racing cycling.

[dcolum23]

"Guinea" and not "ginea" and be it both pig or fowl just do it, why wait, try and buy, bet unless you race, it will be fine.
I have been weaning off shim stuff for a while now as consider they now just designed for looks and they have been testing stuff in terms of quality on the market since the 5600/6600 era.
Once you get microshift parts or to a lesser degree sunrace in your hands you will see it is simple, well made and just works - well.

The price from sensah is just bike parts without a huge marketing cost added on, like most things from Main Land China the quantity, end product finish quality and maybe the design will improve rapidly once they understand that they could export in volume.
My call is they wont bother and just focus on the domestic market and near by countries such as Laos, India, VietNam and Thai markets which are having huge growth in faster but maybe not racing cycling.

I'm definitely leaning that very same direction. I'll keep you guys posted.

[familyguy]

Once you get microshift parts or to a lesser degree sunrace in your hands you will see it is simple, well made and just works - well.

The price from sensah is just bike parts without a huge marketing cost added on, like most things from Main Land China the quantity, end product finish quality and maybe the design will improve rapidly once they understand that they could export in volume.

I've had some Microshift shifters come past me before, which felt and worked well. Ditto for Sunrace cassettes. Some of this Sensah stuff is a level above in terms of quality*, but still not at Big 3 levels. It will come if they want to spend a little more money and/or time to get QC and processes. They may even manage this without breaking some magical figure that people would be wiling to spend on it. For me, at less than 50% of the price of a new R7000 105 groupset (via an Aus. supplier, now that geoblocking is at work), this should be a no-brainer as far as value for money is concerned. The cost/life sums are yet to happen though.

* See the pics and comments about some of the finishes, brakes in particular, and bad assembly of RD.

Jim

[find_bruce]

For me, at less than 50% of the price of a new R7000 105 groupset (via an Aus. supplier, now that geoblocking is at work), this should be a no-brainer as far as value for money is concerned. The cost/life sums are yet to happen though.

And this where is the arrogance of Shimano leads. Thinking they can charge higher prices in countries like Aus simply opens the door for competitors. Only a matter of time before someone disrupts quasi-monopoly pricing

[familyguy]

If you haven't already, you should check out Trace Velo's videos on YouTube about Sensah Empire.

Those are good. I did like the video about the update from V2 to V3 with the shifting lever. It did catch my eye as something that was a little exposed and perhaps prone to over-stressing it. Will be looking at mine later but I think I may have the V3 shifters with the metal lever.

[BradL]

My experience to date. I've fitted a V3 Empire shift kit to an old Tange 1 Europa frame and have clocked around 500k on it. Wasn't expecting much but after a bit of tweaking I am pleasantly surprised.

I did have to soak both derailleurs in lanox before installing as the knuckles were pretty stiff out of the box. After doing this everything worked fine, apart from an occasional slow upshift in the lower range of the cassette. Felt like the mechanism in the shifter wasn't quite releasing properly. New cables/outers so likely not that. Again I resorted to spraying plenty of lanox into the shifter mechanism, and it's worked perfectly ever since. Fingers crossed...

What I've gleaned from this is that the design itself is fine, but the assembly/qc leaves a little too be desired. I guess this is reflected in the price.

My point of comparison is 5800 on my ti bike. The Empire has a very different shift feel, which took some getting used to, but post lanox treatment the shifts are efficient and reliable. Front and rear. It is clearly less well finished in places than the Shimano gear, but it looks good on the bike still. Longevity is the real test though. The 5800 has been flawless over 6500 hilly km. Well see..

[familyguy]

I did have to soak both derailleurs in lanox before installing as the knuckles were pretty stiff out of the box. After doing this everything worked fine, apart from an occasional slow upshift in the lower range of the cassette. Felt like the mechanism in the shifter wasn't quite releasing properly. New cables/outers so likely not that. Again I resorted to spraying plenty of lanox into the shifter mechanism, and it's worked perfectly ever since. Fingers crossed...

Thanks for the notes. That ties with my initial thought about the deraillerus feeling tight/stiff. Will give the levers more of a look soon, based on these comments.

My point of comparison is 5800 on my ti bike. The Empire has a very different shift feel, which took some getting used to, but post lanox treatment the shifts are efficient and reliable. Front and rear. It is clearly less well finished in places than the Shimano gear, but it looks good on the bike still. Longevity is the real test though. The 5800 has been flawless over 6500 hilly km. Well see..

For test purposes (when I can get to it, I need to move house soon so this project has been put on the backburner somewhat!) I will get comparisons to:
SRAM
Force 10s carbon (c.2010)
Rival 10s

Shimano
Ultegra 6700
105 5700
Tiagra 4700
600 Tricolour with downtube shifting (yes, it's worth a bit of a comparison as this stuff shifts *chefs kiss*)

Campagnolo
Centaur V2 ergo/10s
Maybe even by the time I get to all this I can even get the Athena V3 ergo/11s onto something as well.

Many of these are on steel bikes, which will probably be what the Empire gets put onto, at this stage unless something else comes up.

Jim

[familyguy]

I must know more!

I am currently riding a much older Shimano 105 groupset and I'm tempted to "upgrade" to the Sensah Empire ... but like everyone, I'm hesitant. Will it actually be an upgrade? If so, how?

Can't wait to hear more about this @familyguy

If you haven't already, you should check out Trace Velo's videos on YouTube about Sensah Empire.

This stuff is all V3.

[baabaa]

I must know more!

I am currently riding a much older Shimano 105 groupset and I'm tempted to "upgrade" to the Sensah Empire ... but like everyone, I'm hesitant. Will it actually be an upgrade? If so, how?

Can't wait to hear more about this @familyguy

If you haven't already, you should check out Trace Velo's videos on YouTube about Sensah Empire.

This stuff is all V3.

so....
https://open.spotify.com/track/65aZDJQw ... mBj1nQWjNg

[familyguy]

Thread dredge! FINALLY getting around to fitting this gear for a test.


Semi compact gives off real 1:1 vibes in 1st gear, but I think its 36/25.




More work next week, hoping to even ride it next weekend!

Jim

[uart]

Thread dredge! FINALLY getting around to fitting this gear for a test.

Interesting looking groupset Jim, I'm keen to know how it goes.

BTW. I like the look of most of it, but those cranks arms kinda look a bit like a Soviet cold war era design. You know, something like "People's main service crank arms #1".

[familyguy]

Interesting looking groupset Jim, I'm keen to know how it goes.

BTW. I like the look of most of it, but those cranks arms kinda look a bit like a Soviet cold war era design. You know, something like "People's main service crank arms #1".

Utilitarian. Also very much like Rotor cranks from 10 years ago. Felt very similar!

[warthog1]

I don't mind the look of the cranks. Never seen them in the wild though.
Also interested to hear how it rides.

[foo on patrol]

I don't mind the look of the cranks. Never seen them in the wild though.
Also interested to hear how it rides.

A mate of mine has the full group set and it works very nicely.

Foo