Cheaper cassettes

[warthog1]

Spotted a post by someone on here about a video showing a relatively light and cheap cassette;



I ended up ordering the wrong one . The one I got has the largest (low) gears made from a block of aluminium.





They are thicker than the other individual smaller (tall) gears. It shifts fine and rides fine, but it remains to be seen how long the aluminium gears last. Still they have more teeth to spread the load and chainrings last ages and are aluminium so we will see. I will report back.

I have ordered another in steel as I originally wanted.


I have been running Sunrace cassettes in 11s on my other bikes for some time and they have been fine. Will see how these ZTTO goers compare.

Sunrace do have a 12s cassette in the right range but it aint light or particularly cheap.
https://sunrace.com/product/csrz800-wav/

[CmdrBiggles]

Eugh-! In rainbow flavour??

'tis a near-perfect colour combo match for my 1984-vintage ConFest (AT) Everton tie-dyed (and tatty) T-shirt.

If SRAM gets on board with this wild retro-hip colour job, I'm in!

[Duck!]

Light, strong, cheap. Choose two.

[2wheels_mond]

Light, strong, cheap. Choose two.

For cassettes, I'd add 'good shifting' into that as well, and choose three. Cassettes are very reliant on meshing with chain profiling, particularly on 12 speed.

I've had no trouble (for a very short time of use) using a 10 speed cassette from AliExpress (branded as Sensah, but seemingly the same one also often branded 'Sunshine' and a few others on AliExpress). For 12 speed though, the tighter tolerances I expect leave less room for error.

A few experiences here from the Chinertown forums were not all that positive on the 12 speed versions of the monoblock cassettes like the one in Trace Velo's video when used with Shimano 12 speed:

http://chinertown.com/index.php/topic,3897.60.html

[warthog1]

I just indexed the di2 on my 12s for the other wheel it went on that has the freehub more outboard.



It is shifting fairly well so far, but yes not as good as the shimano cassette on my other wheel. Still satifactory however. No failed changes, just not as snappy. Will see if that remains the case.

[elantra]

Light, strong, cheap. Choose two.

For cassettes, I'd add 'good shifting' into that as well, and choose three. Cassettes are very reliant on meshing with chain profiling, particularly on 12 speed.

I've had no trouble (for a very short time of use) using a 10 speed cassette from AliExpress (branded as Sensah, but seemingly the same one also often branded 'Sunshine' and a few others on AliExpress). For 12 speed though, the tighter tolerances I expect leave less room for error.

A few experiences here from the Chinertown forums were not all that positive on the 12 speed versions of the monoblock cassettes like the one in Trace Velo's video when used with Shimano 12 speed:

http://chinertown.com/index.php/topic,3897.60.html

Personally I really prefer my shifts to be “clunky”
As far as I am concerned the Shimano 9-speed (and greater) systems are disappointingly smooth and seamless.
So I prefer the cogs on cassettes and freewheels to NOT have those little ramps.

It’s actually more than just subjective- being able to unmistakably hear the shifts being completed is very beneficial if using friction (not indexed) shifters.

Confessions of a Retro-grouch ?
Actually I do prefer indexed shifters, but sometimes when your bike has a mismatch of Suntour, Shimano, and Campagnolo components from different eras in the drivetrain - that’s the only way to make it work !

[g-boaf]

Personally I really prefer my shifts to be “clunky”

I don't know, I like the shifting to just work.

I'd be annoyed if the shifts didn't work properly or were clunky. If that were happening on any bike I'd be pulling it apart and giving it damn good service.

[warthog1]

Back at work so haven't had another ride yet. But hey it did work, just changed up the cassette a touch slower. The ramping maybe isn't quite as efficient. Over 100g lighter and significantly cheaper. The shifting is good enough, that if the durability is there, I'd choose it over genuine.

[g-boaf]

On the WW forums we used to see people with the uber light cassettes ripping them apart.

The cassettes were great for getting their bike down to a particular weight but not suitable for spirited riding. Cannot remember the brand of cassette as it was many years ago.

[warthog1]

I have seen a few with weak carriers on there. WW is s good place to go for an argument with obstinate opinions.

[WyvernRH]

On the WW forums we used to see people with the uber light cassettes ripping them apart.

Being ignorant, what/where are 'WW Forums' ??
I'm assuming it relates to 'Weight Watchers' or Weight Weenies' and refers to the bike not the rider?

Going back to freewheel days, IIRC Campag had a freewheel with hardened aluminium cogs for the weight conscious. Worked fine til you wore thru the hardened layer and then it all went to hell. Good for a stage or two but that was all. Others tried to copy this (Sachs/Maillard maybe?) but that was a disaster. Not only was the hardening substandard and wore quickly but the body/cog interface was not as well designed so under heavy load the cogs ripped off the body allowing free rotation. Not good when out of the saddle.
One fashion that died very quickly....

Richard

[g-boaf]

On the WW forums we used to see people with the uber light cassettes ripping them apart.

Being ignorant, what/where are 'WW Forums' ??
I'm assuming it relates to 'Weight Watchers' or Weight Weenies' and refers to the bike not the rider?

Weight weenies forum. I think some of the riders on there are also equally as light as the bikes. But I'm not a member of that forum and rarely look at it.

[am50em]

Cheap being relative but light

[warthog1]

A user on chinertown apparently snapped 2 teeth from an aluminium gear very early on though. A scratching based on that.

[warthog1]

Well that cassette is still going. I wouldn't buy another however. The shifting on the bottom end of the cassette is not up to spec. Had multiple adjustments using the di2 setting. Just cant get it satisfactory.
One gear wont drop down reliably yet if I adjust it the other way, another wont step up reliably. Not terrible enough to take it off but annoying enough that I wouldn't get another. The aluminium gears at the top of the cassette shift fine.

Having said I wouldn' t get another I did order the one I was after originally. All steel. Based on my experience of the other where the steel teeth are the problem I am not expecting much.

[blizzard]

Very interested in how the mono block cassette goes, I'm not sure you can draw a conclusion based on the current cassette, there is a lot of rebranding on AliExpress so they could easily have come out of different factories.

[warthog1]

Very interested in how the mono block cassette goes, I'm not sure you can draw a conclusion based on the current cassette, there is a lot of rebranding on AliExpress so they could easily have come out of different factories.

I don't really understand how their branding goes then?

I guess you are saying ztto are just an umbrella for a number of factories to flog their gear off?

It'll be a while until I try it, unless the average shifting on the original one does my head in and I bin it.
Entirely possible I guess.

[blizzard]

Very interested in how the mono block cassette goes, I'm not sure you can draw a conclusion based on the current cassette, there is a lot of rebranding on AliExpress so they could easily have come out of different factories.

I don't really understand how their branding goes then?

I guess you are saying ztto are just an umbrella for a number of factories to flog their gear off?

It'll be a while until I try it, unless the average shifting on the original one does my head in and I bin it.
Entirely possible I guess.

Pretty much, I think Ztto is a legit brand but they will find factories making a product and pay them to brand it Ztto. My experience with Ztto is that they are generally good quality. Cassettes are a bit harder because Shimano has the patent on HG teeth etc.

Life is too short for poor shifting, I would be changing the cassettes over at least to try at the first opportunity, and run whatever shifts best.

[Jean]

Pretty much, I think Ztto is a legit brand but they will find factories making a product and pay them to brand it Ztto. My experience with Ztto is that they are generally good quality. Cassettes are a bit harder because Shimano has the patent on HG teeth etc.

I'm pretty sure the Shimano HG patents would have expired by now, it's been around for ages. A quick internet search suggests this is the case https://www.bicycleretailer.com/opinion ... s-flourish.

So any dodgy Chinese shifting is probably more about their capacity or willingness to emulate it at a cheaper price point.

[am50em]

Interesting article! Thanks.

[warthog1]

Life is too short for poor shifting, I would be changing the cassettes over at least to try at the first opportunity, and run whatever shifts best.

Rewaxed chain on yesty and swapped the steel/ aluminium cassette for the all steel one.
It takes a few ks for a newly waxed chain to free up and shift perfectly ime, so not sure how it is yet. Woeful weather today, hopefully I can get another ride in tomorrow. I will report back how it rides/shifts with a 12s shimano chain.

The steel/aluminium one I have got about the best I can. Gear 8 》9 doesn't shift down immediately. A full crank spin or two as it clicks away without shifting. However at the same time 11 》 10 is hesitant to go back up the cassette and is almost the same. So if I adjust the derailleur further down the cassette that shift up won't work.
I did note when I took the cassette off the lock nut came off with not much force. I definitely torqued it to at least 40nm with a 1/2" drive torque wrench when I installed it. Dunno if torqueing it back up would have helped?
Set the torque wrench to about 45nm installing the new one.

[enerondondon]

I've been using ZTTO products for a while now, and they have pretty decent quality

[warthog1]

120k on the black all steel cassette today.
Prompted by another thread I checked the B screw adjustment.
https://bettershifting.com/installation ... ent-guide/
Yep a little bit too much clearance. I gave it more when I went from 30-11 to 34-11.
Wound it a few mm closer. Stopped twice on the ride to adjust the derailleur. Moved it a total of 3 clicks further out. It is shifting pretty well on all gears. Just gear 9 》10 takes a slight hesitation to drop down. All shift up fine. Might give it one more click before the next ride.
Got me stuffed why I needed to click it further outboard than the previous cassette on the same hub?
Anyway, if it keeps shifting well and proves durable I would get this cassette again. Will see how it goes and report back.

[warthog1]

Had a ride on the other wheelset with the 105 11-34 the other day.
Double Mt Alex today on the WRs with the steel Ztto cassette.
Shifting is pretty close to the 105 cassette. Certainly good enough for me.
If it remains durable then it will be my go to cassette.

[rangersac]

I've used the 9-42 ZTTO 11 speed cassettes paired with a 30T chainring on the MTB for ages and they have been great. Recently chucked on an ultralight 11-46 cassette on the gravel bike and that shifts beautifully. Will have to wait and see on longevity.