news.com.au whining about cyclists in Centennial Park

[find_bruce]

Do the 16 riders have to know each other? How does one know where the 16 riders starts and ends? I've been riding in CP on a weekend and sometimes it's just a large continuous snake of riders, so I'd be curious to know how the person handing out fines would be able to count 16 riders in a defined group, and then be able to pull them all over. What happens if some of the riders say "why are you pulling me over, I am not with them?".

No need to be prearranged - but it would be an interesting question, which is lawyer speak for expensive and uncertain

[London Boy]

Do the 16 riders have to know each other? How does one know where the 16 riders starts and ends? I've been riding in CP on a weekend and sometimes it's just a large continuous snake of riders, so I'd be curious to know how the person handing out fines would be able to count 16 riders in a defined group, and then be able to pull them all over. What happens if some of the riders say "why are you pulling me over, I am not with them?".

No need to be prearranged - but it would be an interesting question, which is lawyer speak for expensive and uncertain

If you can add in some cross-jurisdictional stuff, even better.

[queequeg]

Do the 16 riders have to know each other? How does one know where the 16 riders starts and ends? I've been riding in CP on a weekend and sometimes it's just a large continuous snake of riders, so I'd be curious to know how the person handing out fines would be able to count 16 riders in a defined group, and then be able to pull them all over. What happens if some of the riders say "why are you pulling me over, I am not with them?".

No need to be prearranged - but it would be an interesting question, which is lawyer speak for expensive and uncertain

Apparently under Rule 25 you also need written permission of the Trust or the Chief Executive to ride a bicycle on Trust Lands.

[trailgumby]

Is anyone surprised to hear that News got it completely and utterly wrong?

Their description of the road rules is close enough for present purposes. The bit they miss is that the road rules do not apply in Centennial Park - it's subject to the Centennial Park and Moore Park Trust Act 1983 and regulations.

Does that mean mandatory helmet rules do not apply within the inclosed bounds of the parklands?

Reason for asking is that a few years ago I attended a Freestyle Cyclists protest there. We were met within 200m with something like six police cars if memory serves correctly. Clearly we were a serious and imminent terrorist threat to the social cohesion of the nation. I am sure that Special Operations Group was not far away.

One of our cohort was fined for helmet non-compliance. The rest of us were ordered to walk our bikes. Tea and scones were ordered from the cafe to restore equilibrium.

If they don't, it might be useful to try again and see what happens.

[human909]

It would have expected it to be considered a road related area so road rules apply.

Though that then begs the question why the bothered including some road rules in the Centennial Park and Moore Park Trust Regulation 2014.

[trailgumby]

It would have expected it to be considered a road related area so road rules apply.

Though that then begs the question why the bothered including some road rules in the Centennial Park and Moore Park Trust Regulation 2014.

Exactly. There's an interesting conflict there. What are the implications? My legal training is too limited to be able to unpack that without a lot of reading, but find_bruce has had a little more practice than most, so I'm very interested in his thoughts on the issues.

[find_bruce]

Apparently under Rule 25 you also need written permission of the Trust or the Chief Executive to ride a bicycle on Trust Lands.

Not quite - you need written permission to ride in a group of more than 16, alongside more than 1 other rider, on a footpath etc .

I was surprised about the pedal car though - does the green rocket count?

[find_bruce]

Does that mean mandatory helmet rules do not apply within the inclosed bounds of the parklands?

Reason for asking is that a few years ago I attended a Freestyle Cyclists protest there. We were met within 200m with something like six police cars if memory serves correctly. Clearly we were a serious and imminent terrorist threat to the social cohesion of the nation. I am sure that Special Operations Group was not far away.

One of our cohort was fined for helmet non-compliance. The rest of us were ordered to walk our bikes. Tea and scones were ordered from the cafe to restore equilibrium.

If they don't, it might be useful to try again and see what happens.

Nope the mandatory helmet rules don't apply, but regulation 18(l) prohibits riding a "cycle, horse or scooter without wearing a protective helmet" - unlike the road rules there is no definition of a helmet & I can't see anything that requires it to be commercially made so anything resembling a helmet and offering some protection should do. Paper mache is probably pushing it.

[find_bruce]

It would have expected it to be considered a road related area so road rules apply.

Though that then begs the question why the bothered including some road rules in the Centennial Park and Moore Park Trust Regulation 2014.

I can understand why you would expect that, but your expectations are misplaced. Importantly it's not a road, in the same way that Sandown racetrack is not a road. This particular area is more like a "public golf course" - it's not owned by the government but by a corporation who decides who can use it and in what circumstances - in this case the gates are shut every night

[trailgumby]

Nope the mandatory helmet rules don't apply, but regulation 18(l) prohibits riding a "cycle, horse or scooter without wearing a protective helmet" - unlike the road rules there is no definition of a helmet & I can't see anything that requires it to be commercially made so anything resembling a helmet and offering some protection should do. Paper mache is probably pushing it.

Thanks, missed that. Max 10 penalty units - $1,100

[Thoglette]

I can understand why you would expect that, but your expectations are misplaced. Importantly it's not a road,

This side of the rabbit proof fence some of the road rules do apply in "road related areas" - specifically hooning and driving while pissed. But importantly they only apply to MVs. A bit like RBT.

Now, not that that would stop certain sections of NSW's finest from a little overreach in enforcing the law. But it seems they've moved on from cyclists to new threats to the fabric of society

Plus ça change

[queequeg]

Apparently under Rule 25 you also need written permission of the Trust or the Chief Executive to ride a bicycle on Trust Lands.

Not quite - you need written permission to ride in a group of more than 16, alongside more than 1 other rider, on a footpath etc .

I was surprised about the pedal car though - does the green rocket count?

Ah yes, I didn't spot that distinction. I think the pedal cars refer to those pedi-cab contraptions they hire out on in the park.

[find_bruce]

Ah yes, I didn't spot that distinction. I think the pedal cars refer to those pedi-cab contraptions they hire out on in the park.

You could be right - I was thinking more like

[Johnj]

Meanwhile back on topic. I was in Centennial Park this morning, doing about 25 kph piloting a tandem, chatting with a club mate riding next to me. Three unleashed dogs bolted into the cycle lane, one threading the needle between the two bikes. The dopey owner issued a desultory “sorry” and copped an earful from me.

He’d have been very sorry if the dog had been hit and killed by a 200 kg tandem outfit and he’d been presented with a large injury payout claim from 2 injured cyclists.